To a son of God
Viewing comments for Chapter 3 "Pleasure or Pain?"Metre ... Freeverse & Quatrain
69 total reviews
Comment from Onixxiya
Not being religious as such myself, I am nonetheless intrigued by the subject.
Such a creepy image, and "somehow the pleasure did not look the same" really holds some clout.
Thanks for sharing this truly eerie story.
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Not being religious as such myself, I am nonetheless intrigued by the subject.
Such a creepy image, and "somehow the pleasure did not look the same" really holds some clout.
Thanks for sharing this truly eerie story.
Comment Written 05-Aug-2012
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Glad it had a desired effect.
Comment from MumEsGirl
This was a well written work and a novel approach to selling your soul.
Strange how people have a change of heart as the clock winds down
hugs
kate
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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This was a well written work and a novel approach to selling your soul.
Strange how people have a change of heart as the clock winds down
hugs
kate
Comment Written 05-Aug-2012
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Time stands still for no man...
Comment from donaldww
The devil asks a man question Pleasure or pain? in this DIckensish-style confrontation between man and ghost. The man opts for pleasure and then asks the price. It is death, with a neon sign about sin flashes, but rather than opting for pain (the only other choice offered) the man bows before his grave an prays.
The theme 'the wages of sin is death' makes an assumption here that I don't see. Namely, that pleasure = sin. For that matter, pain does not equal sin either. I don't see the connection in the poem or in life. Many forms of pleasure don't have anything to do with sin. Listening to music, going for a swim, a holiday, visiting Grandma, giving a gift, etc. If I stub my toe, or bang my head, that's not a sin either.
I did enjoy reading the poem (oops, did I say pleasure LOL), it is well-wriiten, but it just doesn't make any sense to me.
DW
I'm sure you derived pleasure from writing this poem. Hopefully, that isn't considered a sin. :)
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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The devil asks a man question Pleasure or pain? in this DIckensish-style confrontation between man and ghost. The man opts for pleasure and then asks the price. It is death, with a neon sign about sin flashes, but rather than opting for pain (the only other choice offered) the man bows before his grave an prays.
The theme 'the wages of sin is death' makes an assumption here that I don't see. Namely, that pleasure = sin. For that matter, pain does not equal sin either. I don't see the connection in the poem or in life. Many forms of pleasure don't have anything to do with sin. Listening to music, going for a swim, a holiday, visiting Grandma, giving a gift, etc. If I stub my toe, or bang my head, that's not a sin either.
I did enjoy reading the poem (oops, did I say pleasure LOL), it is well-wriiten, but it just doesn't make any sense to me.
DW
I'm sure you derived pleasure from writing this poem. Hopefully, that isn't considered a sin. :)
Comment Written 05-Aug-2012
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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I hope not but Ill let you search the reviews for your answers as they are all there...it will be a pleasure...
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Ijust wondered whether you had found any replies to reviews that made you think a little different that may give my poetic piece a differnt interpretation or perception which you may of had at first. You got me thinking thts for sure how could all these wonderful pleasure be sin...thought provoking, but just for you...Listening to music, suppose it was music with lyrics that dement you into suicide or crime because the music made it sound cool. Going for a swim, perhaps you dont like somebody and you invite them along and lo and behold you get in your tiny mind to do away with them by drowning them, perhaps you go on your own and feel obliged to laugh at everyones bodies less fortunate than yourself, maybe this is all part of the fun involved in your swimming trip. A holiday, perhaps you enjoy the holiday because your taking your neighbours wife with you and commiting adultery. Ahhhh, visiting grandma, perfect. Perhaps youve been looking forward to the inheritance and smother here with a pillow whilst she sleeps....the perfect crime, such an innocent visit...what abou the giving of a gift, how adorable, maybe it contains a lewd photo of someone you do not like for the intention of blackmail, etc. Make any sense now....!!!!!
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Thank you for your extended reply. I appreciate the effort you have put in to it!
The hypothetical situations that you describe are ones that are, indeed, headed toward sin.
However, the motivations for these sinful acts are not the pleasurable activities themselves. The motivations came from somewhere else, contemplated ahead of the situations. The perpetrators are using these situations to ensure the victims are caught off guard. What you are describing are criminal minds, not the majority of folks who like to enjoy themselves from time to time.
If your theory were true, then every time I listened to a piece of music, read a poem, went to a movie, or ate one of Grandma's chocolate chip cookies that I would be compelled to commit a sinful act. This is simply not the case, and I dare say, not the case for you either.
And so, I continue to maintain that pleasure does not cause people to sin, nor is it sinful. The two concepts--pleasure and sin--are separate and distinct.
Furthermore, anyone who believes that pleasure is a sin, or causes sin, is setting themselves up for a life of guilt. And that is an unhealthy state of mind.
DW
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Well I'll put it laymans terms for you...DWW...
As I said I have already answered the question, all you had to do was go and find it...maybe it would be a labour of love...
Anyways, I'll try to be as clear as possibly...
Sin = "a transgression" of the Ten Commandements or the moral law.
Soul = "Sin" outwith saving grace. If you believe in a soul then you would agree that its purpose is to govern the body and its acts.
Pleasure = "enjoyable experience"
Now, I believe that the soul is governed and ruled by sin outwith saving grace.
If this is the case, then, to engage in an activity or vice that transgresses the moral law or Ten Commandments, outwith saving grace is a pleasure to the soul because sin is thriving in a sinful enviroment.
The reason that sin is enjoyable at this stage is because there is no Holy goverment to contradict or to oppose that sin other than the conscience which is a faculty of the soul.
The conscience is not alive because the soul is dead in its sin and therefore the soul thrives on sin. Therfore enjoyment is gained.
When Holy goverment comes to the soul, or saving grace, the conscience is awakened from its darked condition and in the nature of saving grace the goverment or dominion of sin is broken.
Hence, the desire for sin is changed fron sin to righteousness and holiness. The sin still dwells in the soul but it does not and never will have the power that it thrived with before, why not?
...because grace has delivered the soul from that kingdom and though sin fights against righteousness it will not prevail, or over come, its government.
So really the equation is:
Soul=desire=sin=enjoyment=conviction=regeneration=grace.
or, as I believe:
Repentance=Regeneration=Justification
=Sanctification=Glorification.
Comment from Nhala
WOW THIS BLEW MY SOCKS OFF! hah, my type of poem! I have written a few ditties very similar, but not as good. You have captured Aesop AND Blake/Milton/Anne Rice all at once! This totally rulez and 5 star cap is not fair. "gave vice and advised" brilliant wordplay here. I could read more on and on. Very nice work
byron nhala
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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WOW THIS BLEW MY SOCKS OFF! hah, my type of poem! I have written a few ditties very similar, but not as good. You have captured Aesop AND Blake/Milton/Anne Rice all at once! This totally rulez and 5 star cap is not fair. "gave vice and advised" brilliant wordplay here. I could read more on and on. Very nice work
byron nhala
Comment Written 05-Aug-2012
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Excellent glad you could enjoy...
Comment from Heaven Bound
Good afternoon. What a dark side approach to the understanding of the wages of sin. Sometimes that's exactly what needs to be revealed. God's works in all the ways His word is proclaimed.
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Good afternoon. What a dark side approach to the understanding of the wages of sin. Sometimes that's exactly what needs to be revealed. God's works in all the ways His word is proclaimed.
Comment Written 05-Aug-2012
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Excellent HB...He needed to realise his need, hence, little mans conviction.
Comment from pattipac
Like the tale told about the rewards and pitfalls of seeking a life of pleasure. When asked what we want in life, pleasure of pain? We, naturally, tend to seek pleasurable experiences. This is all good and well till we face the end of life. For pleasure seekers make tend to make gods of themselves, for there is no pain of sacrifice of service to others in a life filled with pleasure.
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Like the tale told about the rewards and pitfalls of seeking a life of pleasure. When asked what we want in life, pleasure of pain? We, naturally, tend to seek pleasurable experiences. This is all good and well till we face the end of life. For pleasure seekers make tend to make gods of themselves, for there is no pain of sacrifice of service to others in a life filled with pleasure.
Comment Written 05-Aug-2012
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Pleasures can be ligit in their proper context but when outside of saving grace their is no ligitimacy that allows sin to go unrewarded...and it may never be rewarded until the time of death...remember sin is the transgression of the moral law or Ten Commandments, hence, to the dead in sin all things are ligitimate.
As I think the Satanist Bible says somewhere along the lines, "The Law is, Do As Thou Wilt" in other words there is no law.
Comment from sweetwoodjax
this is very well written, bicpen, you did an excellent job writing this poem that shows just because it looks good and feels good doesn't mean the end won't bring death. great imagery
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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this is very well written, bicpen, you did an excellent job writing this poem that shows just because it looks good and feels good doesn't mean the end won't bring death. great imagery
Comment Written 05-Aug-2012
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Excellent SWJ...although God does not leave us without ligitimate pleasures such as the wonder of procreation within marriage...and not of a same sex one at that...!
Maybe if someone does'nt understand that they could check out my poem called, Strange...!
Comment from Earl of Oxford
LOL at your notes - I guess your friend was dressed in leather at the time, and you were holding a whip. LOL!
Spooky picture.
Excellent write which at first reminded me of an old Chinese philosopher training his apprentice, before the devilment kicked in.
Thought-provoking stuff, and even last line is interestingly ambiguous, as he could be 'bowing' before his own grave, OR that of his mentor.
Best wishes, Ray
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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LOL at your notes - I guess your friend was dressed in leather at the time, and you were holding a whip. LOL!
Spooky picture.
Excellent write which at first reminded me of an old Chinese philosopher training his apprentice, before the devilment kicked in.
Thought-provoking stuff, and even last line is interestingly ambiguous, as he could be 'bowing' before his own grave, OR that of his mentor.
Best wishes, Ray
Comment Written 05-Aug-2012
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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MMMM...I dont think my friend uncle Ritchie would look to good in leathers...though I might like to whip him now and again...!
I thought the idea of little man bowing at his grave and praying sort of sunk the message home to him in his vision of pleasure and pain...he saw the reward...and I like to think he high tailed it out of there afterwards and never went back, but we are fickle creatures, such, is the soul.
Comment from sibhus
This was a cool poem. I enjoyed how you put forth astrong messages with wit and humor. It's also a message woth pondering on. The Devil will definitely send the bill for his wages. Again great poem.
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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This was a cool poem. I enjoyed how you put forth astrong messages with wit and humor. It's also a message woth pondering on. The Devil will definitely send the bill for his wages. Again great poem.
Comment Written 05-Aug-2012
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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That he will my friend, that he will,
Much obliged,
Bic.
Comment from Stalking Wolf
Words of truth, many of man's pleasures will bring pain in the end. This makes the devil happy. The other side will bring pleasure now and later. Understand and enjoyed.
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Words of truth, many of man's pleasures will bring pain in the end. This makes the devil happy. The other side will bring pleasure now and later. Understand and enjoyed.
Comment Written 05-Aug-2012
reply by the author on 05-Aug-2012
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Excellent, wherewolf of London any relation...
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Naw, he was a psychopath, I am just a PDI or Pee Dee Indian, or some say Poor Dumb Indian, nice to meet cha. Stalking Wolf.
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Cool....!
