Climate Alarmists vs. Skeptics
Whom do you believe?21 total reviews
Comment from Debbie D'Arcy
I remember you writing about this before, Jim, and I found your argument on the side of the sceptics compelling then and discussed it with my family afterwards. Not so much the red paint analogy but another saturation example. I wholeheartedly agree that this hysteria about climate change and deadlines etc has got out of hand and we are never going to be seeing a world united enough to meet these unrealistic targets in any event. Even if they would make a blind bit of difference.
Your research and commitment here are extremely admirable and the truth is that, given what I know about your impressive attention to detail in your fiction, I'm very much swayed to your side of the argument. I will continue to do what I can to avoid unnecessary CO2 emissions etc. but I won't be driven to believe in some kind of catastrophic finale. Life's too short (already!) And, having spent a great deal of time in France where nuclear energy is the primary source of energy, I'm very supportive of this alternative and get fed up again with all the doom and gloomers.
Thanks for sharing this excellent piece, Jim. Take care Debbie
reply by the author on 08-Apr-2024
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I remember you writing about this before, Jim, and I found your argument on the side of the sceptics compelling then and discussed it with my family afterwards. Not so much the red paint analogy but another saturation example. I wholeheartedly agree that this hysteria about climate change and deadlines etc has got out of hand and we are never going to be seeing a world united enough to meet these unrealistic targets in any event. Even if they would make a blind bit of difference.
Your research and commitment here are extremely admirable and the truth is that, given what I know about your impressive attention to detail in your fiction, I'm very much swayed to your side of the argument. I will continue to do what I can to avoid unnecessary CO2 emissions etc. but I won't be driven to believe in some kind of catastrophic finale. Life's too short (already!) And, having spent a great deal of time in France where nuclear energy is the primary source of energy, I'm very supportive of this alternative and get fed up again with all the doom and gloomers.
Thanks for sharing this excellent piece, Jim. Take care Debbie
Comment Written 07-Apr-2024
reply by the author on 08-Apr-2024
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You are correct, Debbie. I used two examples in my short story called "The Sky is Falling." One was the easter egg dye, and the other was covering a window with brown paper to block the light. The first sheet does the most good, the second a little more light is blocked, but by the third, there's almost no perceptible difference.
Whenever one side tries to suppress the views of the other side, you must sit up and take notice and wonder why they feel the need to do that. Is it that their arguments can't stand up to scrutiny, so they must suppress the scrutiny? That's the usual reason. The movie shows how much of that is happening today, and how difficult it has become for skeptics who are very often shunned for their views. I think it's always shows a weakness in their arguments when they do that.
The alarmists claim that their views are settled science and blame the skeptics for being anti-science, but true science means holding your claims up to rigorous review and when the arguments don't hold up, then abandoning the position. They are afraid to do that, so that's why they feel the need to suppress the skeptics' side. That is anti-science.
Isn't it amazing how often people blame the other side for doing exactly what they, themselves, are doing? Why not let people make up their own minds? That's the scientific approach. That's also called freedom.
Thanks for a wonderful review. It's so gratifying to find a number of people here who think about this issue rationally. I'm hoping to hear some more reviews from the other side to engage them in further discussions.
Comment from Pam Lonsdale
In the first paragraph: you only need "recently" in that last sentence. "fairly recently" is redundant.
The paragraph you wrote taking us back to the Cambrian period sounds exactly like the canned speech we received from a recent house guest (I'm not saying what you have written is canned, but his was well rehearsed and we heard him repeat it to several people). My husband finally asked him to stop talking.
Africa will continue to live in poverty because we want nothing to do with helping them. That isn't going to change if we continue to use fossil fuels.
You'll find "credentials" on the alarmist side of the argument, as well.
I'd like to know where Happer is getting his paint; I have found that the more coats I put on the outside of my house, the darker it becomes.
I'm pretty sure I heard the movie's argument when our house guest was here, but I can give it a look if it's streaming. If it's only available on my computer, I have to ask why there was no funding for it if it's that important.
All I know is that I've heard people talking about climate change for fifty years - that talk is just getting louder because of the seemingly unnatural shifts in weather patterns. Would I be willing to give up some of the conveniences of modern living? Yes, I already have. Would I be willing to put my money where my mouth is? I already do; there are lots of organizations who work toward making our environment safe to live in, including local organizations that teach children and residents the little things they can do to make the world a better place to live in.
I've seen weather changes locally in the eight years I've been in StAug. Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong. My parents taught me to err on the side of caution. I guess that's where I stand.
I know you'll get pushback on this, and lots of people who agree with you. I think the thing that will truly secure our future is the willingness to work together and take everyone's opinions seriously. I don't see that happening short of aliens landing and threatening all of our lives.
I respect your views, and I applaud your research and your willingness to speak your mind.
This is a well-written and well-researched piece, Jim. Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us.
xo
Pam
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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In the first paragraph: you only need "recently" in that last sentence. "fairly recently" is redundant.
The paragraph you wrote taking us back to the Cambrian period sounds exactly like the canned speech we received from a recent house guest (I'm not saying what you have written is canned, but his was well rehearsed and we heard him repeat it to several people). My husband finally asked him to stop talking.
Africa will continue to live in poverty because we want nothing to do with helping them. That isn't going to change if we continue to use fossil fuels.
You'll find "credentials" on the alarmist side of the argument, as well.
I'd like to know where Happer is getting his paint; I have found that the more coats I put on the outside of my house, the darker it becomes.
I'm pretty sure I heard the movie's argument when our house guest was here, but I can give it a look if it's streaming. If it's only available on my computer, I have to ask why there was no funding for it if it's that important.
All I know is that I've heard people talking about climate change for fifty years - that talk is just getting louder because of the seemingly unnatural shifts in weather patterns. Would I be willing to give up some of the conveniences of modern living? Yes, I already have. Would I be willing to put my money where my mouth is? I already do; there are lots of organizations who work toward making our environment safe to live in, including local organizations that teach children and residents the little things they can do to make the world a better place to live in.
I've seen weather changes locally in the eight years I've been in StAug. Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong. My parents taught me to err on the side of caution. I guess that's where I stand.
I know you'll get pushback on this, and lots of people who agree with you. I think the thing that will truly secure our future is the willingness to work together and take everyone's opinions seriously. I don't see that happening short of aliens landing and threatening all of our lives.
I respect your views, and I applaud your research and your willingness to speak your mind.
This is a well-written and well-researched piece, Jim. Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us.
xo
Pam
Comment Written 07-Apr-2024
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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Thank you very much for reading this, Pam, and for your 6 stars. I also appreciate your thoughtful comments. It's apparent you've thought about this issue a lot, and unlike many, you practice what you preach. That's admirable.
It sounds like there's nothing I could say to make you change your mind, but that wouldn't be my goal anyway. My goal in writing this was to encourage people to seek the truth, but you can only know the truth if you listen to several sides of the issue. If there is pertinent information you haven't seen, how can you hope to find the truth?
Did you know before this essay about the diminishing effect of CO2 concentration on temperature increase? I'd be surprised, because no one I've ever talked to before has known that. Yet, to me, that is the most significant argument that makes me skeptical that we are facing a crisis.
I am fairly certain that man will eventually come up with an energy source that is plentiful, safe, cheap, and non-polluting if left free to use his brain, and this will happen long before we ever suffer any ill effects from burning fossil fuels. I'll say it once again, in the Cambrian era, the concentration of CO2 was 16 times higher than now, and it didn't become too hot for life. (Maybe at the equator it would be, but then people would move farther north where it was more like the global average of 72 degrees F.)
Incidentally, in regards to a canned speech, I've never heard anyone talk specifically about the Cambrian period; I simply looked at a chart showing temperature and CO2 concentrations over time and looked up whether or not life existed then.
I couldn't tell you whether or not the recommended film is streaming anywhere, but I would still encourage you to watch it, because they make their points so much better than I do, and I can promise you that you haven't heard many of these points before.
Let's make the stakes a lot bigger for you: Suppose you were the queen of the world, and it was solely up to you to decide if you should ban fossil fuels for everyone as soon as possible or wait until another energy source was discovered that would provide a good standard of living for the world. Would you still refuse to watch this film and possibly learn some things you didn't know, which just might convince you that a lot more research is needed before making such a drastic decision?
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Queen of the World? I would put together a panel of a dozen or so climatologists of differing opinions and tell them to find a solution together. I may have an opinion, but I don't consider myself an extremist.
My CO2 friend sounded very much like you, so I have heard the story about the elevated levels and how they created vegetation instead of destroying it. There's just so many others who believe things have changed, and we are seeing more severe weather each year.
Like I said, I hope you are right.
Comment from jmdg1954
This is way above/ beyond my comprehension. All I know as a kid growing up we had snow all winter long. So over the past 60 + years we are now fortunate to get one per winter(Jersey boy all my life).
So I know climate has changed, but I don't really get into the why's and how's...
We had earthquakes in NJ last Thursday. Never, ever, before...
Enjoy the rest of your Sunday...
John
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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This is way above/ beyond my comprehension. All I know as a kid growing up we had snow all winter long. So over the past 60 + years we are now fortunate to get one per winter(Jersey boy all my life).
So I know climate has changed, but I don't really get into the why's and how's...
We had earthquakes in NJ last Thursday. Never, ever, before...
Enjoy the rest of your Sunday...
John
Comment Written 07-Apr-2024
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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I don't know exactly where you live, John, but I looked up the snowfall totals by year in Newark, NJ. Here are the totals from 1955-1965 and 2013-2023:
1955-1965 ...... 2013-2023
--------------- ..... -----------------
19.7 ------------------ 30.4
35.5 ------------------ 53.4
39.0 ------------------ 45.0
22.0 ------------------ 35.9
22.0 ------------------ 34.3
22.0 ------------------ 38.1
63.5 ------------------ 19.8
21.4 ------------------ 14.6
24.3 ------------------ 34.0
36.4 ------------------ 17.8
23.2 ------------------ 2.6
I think you may be putting a little too much emphasis on 2023's outlier total of 2.6 in.
As far as earthquakes go, even the alarmists aren't claiming that climate change has any effect on earthquake activity except perhaps very indirectly through melting ice caps and glaciers, but this is very local, and I don't think is taking place in NJ.
It's very easy to be deceived by anecdotal information rather than hard data.
Comment from lyenochka
Hi Jim! This should have been in last week's Nonfiction contest. I sent the link to my husband and we'll watch later
Your post reminded me of a meteorologist who was dismissed because he didn't believe in the climate crisis theory. We humans have not changed since the church officials attacked Galileo. These alarmists are no different -just another bunch of bullies in the majority.
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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Hi Jim! This should have been in last week's Nonfiction contest. I sent the link to my husband and we'll watch later
Your post reminded me of a meteorologist who was dismissed because he didn't believe in the climate crisis theory. We humans have not changed since the church officials attacked Galileo. These alarmists are no different -just another bunch of bullies in the majority.
Comment Written 07-Apr-2024
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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Thanks so much, Helen. If you watch the film, you'll see some more evidence of the tough time the skeptics have had in their respective fields due to this bullying. It's really a shame.
Comment from Tom Horonzy
So this is what you do I. Your spare Time. Spooky!
As for me
I remain
The American
That was and shall be until
My feet are
Burning in the fires that follow the calamity people
Think of in using fuels
�
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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So this is what you do I. Your spare Time. Spooky!
As for me
I remain
The American
That was and shall be until
My feet are
Burning in the fires that follow the calamity people
Think of in using fuels
�
Comment Written 07-Apr-2024
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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Me too. Good attitude!
Comment from Dolly'sPoems
Hi Jim,
Did you hear about the iceberg on the loose Jim? It is huge, but will just melt away. I have personally seen no evidence of climate change, but I am no scientist. I think we are wise to be careful about how we dispose of our waste and the products we use, but I think we have far bigger problems in the world than climate change. Nuclear War is what worries me most.
I enjoyed your well presented argument for and against the arguments for climate change and I think I am in your camp with this one. Much enjoyed.
Love Dolly x x x
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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Hi Jim,
Did you hear about the iceberg on the loose Jim? It is huge, but will just melt away. I have personally seen no evidence of climate change, but I am no scientist. I think we are wise to be careful about how we dispose of our waste and the products we use, but I think we have far bigger problems in the world than climate change. Nuclear War is what worries me most.
I enjoyed your well presented argument for and against the arguments for climate change and I think I am in your camp with this one. Much enjoyed.
Love Dolly x x x
Comment Written 07-Apr-2024
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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Thanks, Dolly. I agree--there are much bigger problems facing the world than climate change, which we really can't do much about despite what the alarmists claim.
Comment from barbara.wilkey
AMEN!!! Finally, somebody who agrees with me. I agree that the climate is changes, but I also believe it's normal evolution. Sure we have influenced it. I am hoping at some point we can come up with a reasonable solution to our energy problem but haven't so. Thank you for sharing.
man's use of fossil fuels is causing an unprecedented rise in the levels of CO2 in the atmosphere (Nope, it cow farts!!)
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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AMEN!!! Finally, somebody who agrees with me. I agree that the climate is changes, but I also believe it's normal evolution. Sure we have influenced it. I am hoping at some point we can come up with a reasonable solution to our energy problem but haven't so. Thank you for sharing.
man's use of fossil fuels is causing an unprecedented rise in the levels of CO2 in the atmosphere (Nope, it cow farts!!)
Comment Written 07-Apr-2024
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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Ha-ha! I hope you choose to watch the movie anyway. It was so gratifying to see, finally, something that supported my views for a long time.
Comment from Ulla
Hi Jim, this is a very well written essay on a red hot topi. Yes, the climate is definitely changing and it's become very noticeable over the last twenty years or so.
You might say that I'm sitting on the fence, but I truly believe what we're experiencing is a combination of a natural chance and a manmade one. What I still have to decide is who plays the major role. It a huge topic you're addressing here and you do it with aplomb. Ulla:)))
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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Hi Jim, this is a very well written essay on a red hot topi. Yes, the climate is definitely changing and it's become very noticeable over the last twenty years or so.
You might say that I'm sitting on the fence, but I truly believe what we're experiencing is a combination of a natural chance and a manmade one. What I still have to decide is who plays the major role. It a huge topic you're addressing here and you do it with aplomb. Ulla:)))
Comment Written 07-Apr-2024
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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Thanks very much, Ulla. Don't take my word for it, though. The film makes a much more convincing case than I do. It is a real eye-opener.
Comment from Sally Law
I don't mind weighing in at all. I am not a climate change alarmist. My brother in law told me Florda would be underwater by now and that was ten years ago. He drives a Tesla yet flies and cruises all over the world. I go basically no where. When I do, my husband drives us in our hybrid. I think most preaching this gospel are the worst offenders.
The earth goes through cyles of heating and cooling and solar maximums and solar minimums. (We are set to enter a solor maximum in late 2024 to 2026.) No one hardly speaks of solar maximums or solar minimums. Planetary alignments cause earthquakes too. It's the way God made things and it hasn't changed. The Bible says we'll have all kinds of weather phenomenon prior to the return of Jesus Christ, and an increase in earthquakes. The holy book was written long ago, long before carbon emissions. Many need to check it out and get a life.
Thanks for sharing. I would agree with the 1,900 for sure.
Blessings,
Sal :))
By the way, my husband read this and loved it. We are going to watch the movie asap.
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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I don't mind weighing in at all. I am not a climate change alarmist. My brother in law told me Florda would be underwater by now and that was ten years ago. He drives a Tesla yet flies and cruises all over the world. I go basically no where. When I do, my husband drives us in our hybrid. I think most preaching this gospel are the worst offenders.
The earth goes through cyles of heating and cooling and solar maximums and solar minimums. (We are set to enter a solor maximum in late 2024 to 2026.) No one hardly speaks of solar maximums or solar minimums. Planetary alignments cause earthquakes too. It's the way God made things and it hasn't changed. The Bible says we'll have all kinds of weather phenomenon prior to the return of Jesus Christ, and an increase in earthquakes. The holy book was written long ago, long before carbon emissions. Many need to check it out and get a life.
Thanks for sharing. I would agree with the 1,900 for sure.
Blessings,
Sal :))
By the way, my husband read this and loved it. We are going to watch the movie asap.
Comment Written 07-Apr-2024
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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Thanks so much, Sal.
When you look at a gas that takes up only .04 percent of the atmosphere and compare it to the sun, doesn't common sense say that the sun will probably have more of an effect on warming than CO2? A number of scientists in the film make it very clear that the sun has a much greater effect than CO2, which has virtually no effect on the warming of the Earth. The part of the film on supernovas, cosmic rays, cloud formation, the milky way galaxy, and their effects on the sun I found much more convincing than CO2 ever was.
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Exactly. The Earth's temperature is naturally affected by the solar maximum/minimum. It's the simplest form of science. If we sit closer to a fire, we're warmed. If we move away, we cool off. I think I should get an honorary doctorate for this discovery. Whaddya think? Hahaha. ;))
I really enjoyed your article. Keep at it.
Blessings,
Sal :))
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Yes, I definitely think you deserve one for that bit of brilliance, Sal.
Like Occam's razor, the simplest explanations are often the best ones.
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True again! I checked back to see if you were getting ant bliw bacu on this. It's become a false doctry of our day, really, and a religion to some. Remember when we talked about how good the stuffing was at Thanksgiving dinner? Now it's been reduced to cow farts and Co2. What's become of us?
Be blessed, my friend.
Sal :))
Comment from BethShelby
This is a well thought out and well written essay expressing your opinion of why you fall on the side of ths skeptics. Actually, I've never taken a side on this because I'm really not that concerned one way or the other. I don't plan to change the way I live. I think if time continues there well be better way ways to have the energy we need at that should result in a cleaner world. Many times in the past this world has not been a place mankind could exist and It will one day happen again, not because of anything we have done, but some natural occurance will happen to make it so. There are too many possible natural disasters which could occur and a some point one will. If mankind is involved in the process it will more like be a doomsday weapon rather than CO 2 gasses. I will try to enjoy it while I'm here and let others argue about how it will end.
This rating does not count towards story rating or author rank.
The highest and the lowest rating are not included in calculations.
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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This is a well thought out and well written essay expressing your opinion of why you fall on the side of ths skeptics. Actually, I've never taken a side on this because I'm really not that concerned one way or the other. I don't plan to change the way I live. I think if time continues there well be better way ways to have the energy we need at that should result in a cleaner world. Many times in the past this world has not been a place mankind could exist and It will one day happen again, not because of anything we have done, but some natural occurance will happen to make it so. There are too many possible natural disasters which could occur and a some point one will. If mankind is involved in the process it will more like be a doomsday weapon rather than CO 2 gasses. I will try to enjoy it while I'm here and let others argue about how it will end.
This rating does not count towards story rating or author rank.
The highest and the lowest rating are not included in calculations.
Comment Written 07-Apr-2024
reply by the author on 07-Apr-2024
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That's a good and realistic attitude to have, Beth. I do worry, though, that those who have been poorly schooled (read brain-washed) on the "science" of climate change espoused by the alarmists support the current administration's and much of the western world's governments on the foolishness of becoming carbon neutral before we have a viable alternative to fossil fuels. The movie explains the real agenda of those pushing for it: more government control of our lives--telling us what we can buy, drive, the temperature of our homes, etc.
