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Harambe is ur Daddy

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RE: Why we never learn
Low wage earners don't tend to pay extra taxes because they can't afford rich lawyers, but because they are paying regressive taxes instituted by liberals. Sales taxes, state taxes, inflation, gas taxes, regulations, social security, vehicle registration -- most of these are regressive taxes. Politicians red and blue will throw tax credits and perks at them to make up for it. Some will figure out how to play the system and come out ahead but on net they will end up paying more as the govt spends more, supposedly on their behalf. And govt bureaucracy will keep growing
and growing
and growing


CD Richards

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RE: Why we never learn
Lancellot:

1. "You did not challenge anything I said"

I challenged:
- Your selective use of history to support your case;
- The purpose for which you posted in the first place;
- Your representation of "how the US functions";
- Your attitude on the distribution of wealth;

But apart from those things, you're absolutely right -- I didn't challenge you.

Perhaps so I do better next time, you could define for us in your own terms the difference between arguing and challenging?

2. "You never answered what a fair share is."

That's because you never asked me. You referred to politicians who speak of a "fair share".

3. "You never stated how a person getting richer makes another poor."

Either you have serious comprehension issues, or you don't bother reading what people write in response to you. I went to some lengths to give several examples of exactly that.

In answer to your last point, let me offer my congratulations on your success. However, the statistics you weren't shy in putting out there don't make you rich. As an example, the median house price in Sydney is $1,654,668 (that AU$, so around $1M U.S). Anyone who owns their own house in Sydney is a millionaire. Add a couple of vehicles, some money in the bank, share portfolios, etc. and they are easily well over that. They mostly would take at least a couple of overseas holidays yearly. They would more likely consider themselves middle-class, and describe their lifestyle as somewhere between "adequate" and "comfortable".

So sorry, but you don't qualify when we're talking about the money-grabbing tax frauds, cheats, con-men and shonksters I'm describing here (unless, of course, you are those things, but with less money).

Perhaps you aspire to be them. Good luck with that.


CD Richards

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RE: Why we never learn
Message edited:

Harambe:


"Low wage earners don't tend to pay extra taxes because they can't afford rich lawyers, but because they are paying regressive taxes instituted by liberals."


- State income tax was first introduced by Woodrow Wilson (Democrat) in New York in 1919,


- State sales tax was first introduced by Herbert Hoover (Republican) in Mississippi in 1930.


- Federal gas tax was introduced by Herbert Hoover (Republican) in 1932.


- Vehicle registration was first introduced in New York during the Presidency of William McKinley (Republican), while Benjamin Barker Odell Jr (Republican) was the state governor.


OOPS!


Oh, and BTW... trickle down economics is horse shit.


tde" />



kiwisteveh


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RE: Why we never learn
BTW we seem to have skipped over this absolute F**king nonsense spouted earlier without a single word to justify the truth of any of it...

"It's rich hearing that line from Kamala, who has accepted a billion dollars from the mega-rich. She is mostly just a mindless bot though who does the bidding of her masters, putting Americans back in chains."

So, here's a challenge. Well THREE challenges actually:

1. Where is the evidence that Harris has pocketed a billion dollars from rich donors? The implication in your words is that it is corrupt. Donations to a campaign or to a PAC don't count, of course.

2. Justify the words 'She is a mindless bot doing the bidding of her masters.'
I see this nonsense all the time from the loonies on the right. They used to say it about Biden. Now they have simply transferred the bogus accusations to Harris. So, who are the masters? Give ONE rational example of this.

3. Putting Americans back in chains? Apart prom the over-emotional framing of this, WTF are you actually talking about? What chains? Seems to me her policies are mostly aimed at removing chains, if anything. If you need an example of that just look at the introduction of a fairer health system and targeting the ridiculous costs Americans pay for medicines.


Harambe is ur Daddy

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RE: Why we never learn
CD, it doesn’t matter what party someone was in when they do something. A party does not make someone conservative or liberal. Kennedy cut taxes. Bush 1 raised them. You are dealing with a nonpartisan ape. I attack both sides of the aisle. If Hoover raised taxes, he was not acting as a conservative in the conventional sense.

CD Richards

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RE: Why we never learn
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I wasn't born yesterday, Harambe. Use of the No True Scotsman fallacy will have to be a lot more subtle than that before you'll catch me out.


Unless you want to go back to the caveman era, before there were things like governments and communities, taxes are a necessary evil. No decent, honest person in any civilised society gets to keep all their money for themselves, unless there is some other way to contribute to the communal purse, for example unpaid labour on community projects. I've explained why elsewhere.


Furthermore, civilised societies, at least any society I would want to live in, encourage care for our fellow humans. They regard philanthropy as good and desirable. And, for the most part, they support governments using some of the money they collect in taxes for that purpose.


Some appear to place no value whatsoever in caring for others, and feel that looking after self (and possibly those close to self) is the only important endeavour. They are entitled to their opinion. It's not a popular one, at least in these parts.



CD Richards

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RE: Why we never learn
Message edited:

Steve: I was wondering, prior to your correction, whether you had finally seen sense and made the move back across the ditch.


 


Do you know the Juice Media crowd? If not, you might want to pop over to my "How to combat voter fraud" thread, I think you'd find their latest production amusing.



Harambe is ur Daddy

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RE: Why we never learn
Some taxes yes, but people who don't pay taxes should not be able to vote, yet about half of voters now receive more back than they actually pay in direct taxes (excluding usage taxes, like onsales and fuel) . The US govt spends 7 trillion a year. That's a quarter of our GDP. We spend more on debt repayment than on our military. In fact, military comes in at #5. We need to cut social benefits and bring in more immigrant labor (preferably legally) to fix this ratio.

Fun facts from Google AI -- did you know:

-The bottom half of taxpayers pay an average income tax rate of 3.3%.

-The top 50% of filers earn 90% of all income and pay 98% of all income taxes.

-The top 25% of earners pay 89% of all income taxes.

-The top 1% of taxpayers pay the highest average income tax rate, at 25.93%. They also pay more than $1 trillion in income taxes, which is more than the bottom 90% of taxpayers combined.

What was that again you were saying about fair share?

CD Richards

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RE: Why we never learn
Given your love for statistics, here's a few that should give you a giggle or two. They all refer to the US, as I doubt you'd be interested how they pan out elsewhere:

1. The top (in terms of wealth) 1% own between 30-35% of the wealth.
2. The combined wealth of the top 1% is more than that of the bottom 90%.
3. The poorer half of the population own less than 2% of the wealth.
4. CEO compensation has grown by 1322% since 1978, while a typical worker's pay has increased by 18% in the same period.
5. On average, the CEO of a top company earns over 350 times the salary of a typical worker.
6. Between 1979 and 2020, after-tax income of the wealthiest 1% grew 228% while income for the bottom 20% grew by just 43%.
7. Millennials control 7% of the nation's wealth. Baby Boomers, at the same age, controlled 21%. This disparity is largely caused by high student debt, housing costs and stagnating wages.
8. The median white family has 8-10 times the wealth of the median black family, and 5-7 times that of a Hispanic family.
9. During COVID-19, billionaires increased their wealth by 44% in less than a year, while millions of Americans faced job loss and financial insecurity. The combined wealth of U.S. billionaires is estimated to exceed the GDPs of Canada and Australia.
10. Around 700 individuals have more wealth than the bottom 50% of the country.

"Fair share" would be once you hit $1bn in assets (including those hidden in offshore bank accounts in the Cayman Islands), you get a lovely "Outstanding Achievement in Capitalism" trophy inscribed with your name, a free pizza party, and everything above the threshold is distributed to those who need it to survive.

P.S. As a bonus, I'd be willing to throw in all the champagne, caviar and Cuban cigars you can consume at the party. Well, maybe not caviar, as that's just sick.

CD Richards

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RE: Why we never learn
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Oh, and scratch the cigars, as the smell of them makes me puke. But the champagne stays, promise!


 


P.S. In the interest of full disclosure, the above statistics were provided by ChatGPT.



   
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