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Sarkems
I like bacon
because it tastes good.

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RE: Water
Reply on October 28, 2017 01:53 PM
Oh, sorry, Jimi, it was in response to Steve's comment about 'people without someone like Jimi'. I didn't mean you said all those things, I was simply saying you'd have to have been living under a rock not to know those things already.

To be fair, being poor was a lot of the reason we DIDN'T have cupcakes and coke every day. Being poor used to be a bit of a boon for dental health, since all that sort of stuff was beyond many people's pockets. I'm not sure how anyone can claim poverty would be the reason for choosing coke over water, when water out of the tap doesn't cost at least a quid a bottle.

I work in a shop, and you see families I know aren't that rich shoving the sweeties and coke into their baskets. An apple is 40p, but the kids get a 60p chocolate bar, or a bag of sweets for a pound. That's totally up to them, their choice, but one can't then claim poverty made their health choices for them.


jlsavell

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RE: Water
Reply on October 28, 2017 02:47 PM << Modifed October 28 at 4:02PM >>
This is true Sarkems. Very true. Thank you for clearing that up. I do not want anyone to get me wrong.

In the United States, there is an over abundance of cheap packaged foods with high sugar, sodium, industrialized corn syrup, saturated fats, msg, food coloring and assorted chemicals to hide the bad taste. Sadly, our poverty stricken families resort to these cheap foods to feed their families. I am not condemning them. It is a daunting truth and I blame the food industry for this. The paradox, healthy foods might cost more, sometimes just a fraction more, but healthy food such as healthy fats, fresh produce, legumes, and lean proteins of the meat variety cost much less in the long run for many many reasons. Fast foods and fast cheap preparation filled with all the unhealthy things cause you to consume more, be less satisfied(because you are not giving your body what it needs to create energy and healthy organs), but also lends to the breakdown of a body?s immune defenses and regulation capabilities, thus more susceptible to disease, to obesity in children and adults, which leads to a plethora of alarming and life threatening conditions from heart disease, to diabetes which leads to more health issues, more drugs , more time off work or less time and ability to do the good things for yourself and your family. A vicious cycle.

Never before in the history of our industrialized era has it been determined that our children and our children?s children have less of a lifespan than I do or my parents or my grandparents.

In 2001, the WHO organization reported that in the United States... 100% of 5 year olds which had been autopsied had the beginnings of arteriosclerosis. Alarming to say the least.

The United States is sadly sadly lacking in good health. And why? We are in the low ranking for the top 100 healthiest nations. What a travesty.

Each year we spray over a billion pounds of pesticides on our crops
We feed millions of pounds of antibiotics to our farm animals
We farm , otherwise healthy protein and essential fatty acids,( salmon and other fish) in unhealthy habitats swimming around in their own excrement
We inject our cattle with growth hormones
We eat grains contaminated with mycotoxins(fungal toxins)
We dump billions on tons of toxic waste into our waste sites and rivers
We unknowingly poison our children with vaccinations
We drink water that has been poisoned with flouride, chlorine and other chemicals
We drink diet sodas contaminated with aspartame
We have mouths full of mercury fillings and root canals
We breathe air that has been polluted with ?chem trails" yep I said it
We let Doctors destroy our bodies with X-rays
We smoke cigarettes and drink lots of alcohol
We eat mainly junk food, fast food and processed food
We green harvest
We deplete our soils of much needed nutrients( you know in the Biblical days, the Israelites were commanded to farm a plot for seven years and then let it rest seven years... why... because that is the amount of time it takes to replenish its mineral and nutrient content through a process called the Kreb cycle... imagine that...)
We rarely practice what is healthier for you... consumption close to production

And we wonder why in hell we are not winning the war on cancer, on mental diseases, on Alzheimer?s, on neuromuscular diseases.. come on.

And as far as the ADA, their members are taught and licensed within the medical schools. Light bulb, they know what they know... what they are taught... and I doubt very much Dentistry would be as profitable if all they attended to was healthy teeth. Cleanings are the cheapest of all procedures. Just as the medical industrial complex would not profit from a healthy population.. in fact our economy would implode.

It is also interesting to note that our pharmaceutical giants have their investments in the food industry, among other things. Most Medical Schools are funded by the pharmaceutical industry. Go figure.. so Dr.s know what they know taught in Med school and very few if any hours are dedicated to natural avenues of health. Serves the pharmaceutical giants no purpose. None at all.

Sorry to be on a soapbox. It?s my line of work and my passion which... Keeps me fired up!!!!!

And for the record, those who do have Jimi in their lives know that I am not about control nor preachy preachy. They are perfectly capable of making their own decisions and I respect that Steve. However, I feel strongly that what I have done in my life, I am in better health for it. I am 64 and do not take meds for anything. No need. I am healthy and unlike many of my peers who have resigned that aging is the cause for so much, not true. I have more energy, great mental clarity, no adult acquired cavities, and fewer wrinkles than many many of my relatives and friends who are anywhere from 10 to 20 years younger than I am. I do not mean to sound as if I am bragging, I am trying to convey, I know what I know and I have utilized my talk and I have reaped its benefits.


kiwisteveh


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RE: Water
Reply on October 28, 2017 04:08 PM
Oh, you mean 'I know what I know' in that sense. In that case, here are some things that I know.

1. 'Industrial waste' is an emotive and inflammatory term. I don't know for sure where the fluoride comes from that has been in our drinking water for more than fifty years. It could well be a by-product (there's a nice term) of some manufacturing process - so what? It will meet the specifications laid down by medical experts as being safe. I agree whole-heartedly with those who are immediately suspicious of videos showing nefarious characters dumping skull and crossbones material into the water in the dead of night. That is just rubbish!

Similarly, as soon as I come across an argument that repeatedly uses the terms 'industrial waste' and 'toxins' when discussing fluoride, I am likely to dismiss the whole argument on the basis of bias.

2. The food industry, which of course is driven by the profit motive, is entirely different from public authorities, who, for the most part, are driven by the desire to do what is best for citizens, Mostly they are elected officials who must answer to their constituents of they get it wrong.

3. One swallow does not make a summer, and a case study of one does not make compelling evidence. We all know of people who smoked until they were 102 without a race of lung cancer. Jimi, I'm a year older than you, and I'm the healthiest person I know. I have never sen the inside of a hospital except as a visitor and I avoid the doctor like the plague. I eat what I like, I'm mildly overweight and reasonably active for my age. I put my general good health down to good genes. I'm afraid I do very few of those 'healthy' things that you so admirably ensure you and your family do.

However, my teeth are a disgrace, I admit - possibly due to the fact that we drank water from the creek as kids, not that poisoned stuff the poor town kids had to swallow.

4. I do know that most of those things you advocate are wise, and that if every family followed them, the world would be a healthier place. However, I also know that, human nature being what it is, that will never happen, no matter how much we know about the things that are bad for us.

Like most of the developed world, we have something of an obesity epidemic here. The reason is in that sentence; developed world means affluent world, means we spend our wealth on luxuries, many of which are bad for us.

5. Chem trails? You have to be kidding!

6. Fluoride in drinking water is safe, proven to be safe, and populations where it is used have better long-term health outcomes (yes, other stuff as well as teeth) than those who don't.

7. It's a Sunday, a lovely spring morning and I've got to get out into the garden. I might scare away a few of those swallows who keep shitting in my water tank. They have had a nest in there for the last few years!


jlsavell

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RE: Water
Reply on October 28, 2017 04:27 PM << Modifed October 28 at 4:31PM >>
Take care Steve.

I do appreciate and respect your views. We do not have to agree to be respectful. I have stated why I feel the way I do, as have you.

As for smokers and lung cancer, smoking does a lot more than heighten your chances for lung cancer, a lot more. And yes, not everyone who smokes gets lung cancer, in fact many who don?t get lung cancer. But I bet my seat in hell those smokers have very low oxygen saturation in their cells.

Industrial waste abounds. Toxins abound. I know of no other term to define it.

And I do understand the difference between elected officials overseeing community health versus bid cooperations for profit. However, I do not put much faith in many of the decisions put forth for the ?good" of the community here in the good ole USA.

Take care friend. The garden is a great place to be.

CD Richards

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RE: Water
Reply on October 28, 2017 05:29 PM << Modifed October 28 at 5:35PM >>
Emma:

I hope you weren't referring to my post when you suggested someone had said poor people drink Coke instead of water - that's exactly the opposite to my position.

Now to the fun stuff - the UNICEF report on fluoride you referenced. Thanks for the link, the paper is both interesting and informative - which makes a change from what we have seen so far. However...

There is a saying here, I'm not sure if it's well known globally: "If you can't blind them with science, baffle them with bullshit." I think this is the methodology being adopted here - not by UNICEF, but by the nofluoride.com people, who republish the paper in the hope that people won't pay too much attention to what it does (and, importantly, does not) say.

Firstly, a couple of things the paper does say about fluoride:

* Fluoride is a naturally occurring substance which makes its way into water supplies by natural means.

* The World Health Organisation is just one of many bodies which acknowledges that fluoride is effective in preventing dental cavities.

And most importantly, to what the paper does not say:

* It does not say that fluoride should never be added to community drinking water!

You may correct me if I'm wrong, but if the paper contains any recommendation the practice be abandoned, I missed it. What it does say is this:

"Severe, chronic and cumulative overexposure can cause the incurable crippling of skeletal fluorosis."

And that pretty much sums up what the paper is all about. Needless to say, "severe, chronic and cumulative exposure" to just about anything will kill you!

The paper is largely concerned with discussing areas in Kenya, South Africa and India where naturally occurring fluoride levels in water are between 25 and 40 ppm. The maximum recommended dosing of fluoride in community water supplies by the WHO is 1.5 ppm! The paper is about removing fluoride where it occurs naturally in dangerously high concentrations - up to 40x safe levels. Shouldn't the "non-interventionist" advocates who are against the unnatural practice of adding a minute amount of fluoride to drinking supplies also be against the unnatural removal of deadly quantities of this "poison" from community water sources in impoverished areas?



kiwisteveh


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RE: Water
Reply on October 28, 2017 06:02 PM
Nothing wrong with the term 'industrial waste' in its proper context.

But can you tell me why you insist on calling fluoride industrial waste as if that automatically makes it a bad thing. The only reason I can see is that you want to use an emotive term to bulk up your argument.

With all due respect, you know where you said you're not 'preachy'? I'm afraid, on this issue you come across as very preachy.

Have a lovely day.


jlsavell

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RE: Water
Reply on October 28, 2017 06:10 PM
Steve,

I am not trying to be preachy. But in all due respect you are coming off as rude.

I am no more being preachy about this discussion against industrial waste than you are being preachy about the other side of it.

There is a great great difference between natural flouride and the ?industrial waste ? part which is put in our water supply. A great difference.

If I appear as ?preachy to you" I sincerely apologize. There is no need for the hostility.

I meant it when I said have a great day, but you are intent at coming back with personal assaults., Steve.

I thought I was just participating in a discussion or debate. Christ


reconciled

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RE: Water
Reply on October 28, 2017 06:56 PM
here let me...lol
well we know we can trust your source here when youre no,1 is a hallucination. or maybe you work at a water plant and know exactly what youre dumping in the water. I dont think "naturally" is defined by cracking open a can crap x-d dangerous stuff and dumping on humanity.
Youre outright dismissal of the numerous experts presented is offensive and unmistakably arrogant. the evidence is overwhelming and will be class action litigated not soon enough. not only is it "obvious" through their testimony and test's. but to all of us since we were kids....you dont put yucky stuff in what you eat and drink...or stick your fingers in fire...ouch. now you can argue Santa Clause is coming to town in flying Ford Lincoln continental for I'll care....I've tried to love you....always Michael

CD Richards

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RE: Water
Reply on October 28, 2017 07:05 PM
The problems with your position are legion, Michael. Firstly, for every "expert" (i.e. guy with enough cash to rent a gas mask and rubber gloves) you produce, I'll show you 100 real ones. How is criticising people who can't separate water treatment from alien abductions being arrogant, when ignoring the findings of thousands of properly qualified practitioners isn't?




reconciled

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RE: Water
Reply on October 28, 2017 07:18 PM
-headshake-...."naturally" you'd pick the intermission fifteen minute reel of actual example of our fluoride treatment. not the other three or four possibly five or six "expert" testimony by numerous intelligent credible people...including biologists and other doctors. I will not list them all for you here...they are all ready...all you got to do is push a button....if you care. frankly the way youve treated me I dont give a shit what you do. and have lost any respect I may of held. always Michael

   
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